Ask the Experts: ePMP Troubleshooting


@ninedd wrote:

Hi.  With our older (non Cambium) gear.  About 80% of our support calls for ''slow internet'' are really because the client has an unrestricted Torrent program that they don't understand, or they have devices with Cloud storage aps that they don't understand.  Right now, we can look at our AP's and see all stations and their throughput up/down in real time.

That allows us to see "at a glance" what everyone is doing on the AP, and every day, we probably have a dozen calls where people report 'slow' and we log in and they have 300 KBytes of transmit going on constantly that they are unaware is even happening.  That's out-competing their other traffic and they feel ''slow'' when it's really just 'occupied''.

So, with ePMP - how can I look at an Access Point and see a real-time. constantly updated list of all associated stations and their throughput?  I know we can't do it with our Canopy 900 gear (PMP100) and I don't see how to do that on the Cambium ePMP1000 either.


Under Monitor--Performance you can see total packets & kbits per SM in a list. This is cumulative but increasing every few seconds. A quick look at this will give you an idea of any SM where there is background apps pulling data. Representing this in a rate fashion is something we can look at.

At Monitor -> Performance on the AP, there is a summary of all devices throughput both DL and UL in Kbits.  Below this there are Subscriber Module Statistics that show DL and UL throughput in Kbits for each associated SM.  You can see throughput by observing the increasing totals themselves or also by selecting Reset Stats from this same screen and this will start all stats back at 0 so you can see how quickly the throughput increases.

Hi ninedd, The statistics mentioned by Dan and Sakid are available through SNMP as well. So once you load the ePMP MIB into Cacti (which I believe you are using), you can pull these stats and graph them.

Thanks,

Sriram 

thank you everyone for participating with your questions. Feel free to continue to add questions about ePMP troubleshooting, and we will get to them. Thank you for your business and sharing your ePMP network stories with us.

Thanks also to our ePMP development team. We appreciate your efforts.

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Under Monitor--Performance you can see total packets & kbits per SM in a list. This is cumulative but increasing every few seconds. A quick look at this will give you an idea of any SM where there is background apps pulling data. Representing this in a rate fashion is something we can look at.


Hi.  Thank you, that's a good start.  For us, having this displayed as a 'per second' rate is essential.  And seeing all clients on the AP in one list is essential too.  I'd love to see the Kbit/s (or KByte/s) number in the Monitor -> Wireless list, although adding it to the Monitor->Performance is fine too.  As long as we can see all cleints and their real time RX/TX speeds, that's fine.

Only seeing an increasing kbits total data counters and trying to do the math to figure out a rate, while I'm on the phone with a client....  I can't see that being a long term solution.  Having the display show a Kbit or Kbyte / second rate is essential with all the cloud/torrent issues we deal with.


@Cambium_Sri wrote:

Hi ninedd, The statistics mentioned by Dan and Sakid are available through SNMP as well. So once you load the ePMP MIB into Cacti (which I believe you are using), you can pull these stats and graph them.


Hi.  Yes, I think we have the CACTI graphing thing figured out now.  But, I'm asking about seeing the throughput data in real time, right while we are talking to a client on the phone.  Graphing is cool, but that's waiting 5 or 10 minutes and then seeing 1 or 2 pixels on the graph.

With StarOS or MikroTik, we can see instantly/constantly the throughput that each client is getting at that instant. If the Cambium AP list is updating only every 5 seconds instead, that's fine.  But we will absolutely need to be able to see this info or we are dead in the water with ePMP.  We use this every day, on nearly every single client call.


@ninedd wrote:

@Cambium_Sri wrote:

Hi ninedd, The statistics mentioned by Dan and Sakid are available through SNMP as well. So once you load the ePMP MIB into Cacti (which I believe you are using), you can pull these stats and graph them.


Hi.  Yes, I think we have the CACTI graphing thing figured out now.  But, I'm asking about seeing the throughput data in real time, right while we are talking to a client on the phone.  Graphing is cool, but that's waiting 5 or 10 minutes and then seeing 1 or 2 pixels on the graph.

With StarOS or MikroTik, we can see instantly/constantly the throughput that each client is getting at that instant. If the Cambium AP list is updating only every 5 seconds instead, that's fine.  But we will absolutely need to be able to see this info or we are dead in the water with ePMP.  We use this every day, on nearly every single client call.


Ninedd,

Have you tried our free network management tool CNS. It has the ability to show you the tput graph you are looking for per subscriber along with many other features. While the colors maybe a bit strong in the image below it serves the function you are looking for. I am hesitant to do a real time tput calculation on the radio if the CNS solution suffices

CNS polling times are and will always be too far apart to be a usefull "Instant tput" tool.

We tend to use mikrotik's  "interface>> traffic " graph for troubleshooting, so we can see the traffic bursts.

It updates maybe 2-3 times a second, whereas CNSS updates every 5 minutes.

The main-screen tput graph is updated every 5(2 if you log-in and change it) seconds, and is very nice, even if a bit slow(when i'm looking for real time burst traffic, that is).

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Ninedd,  Have you tried our free network management tool CNS. It has the ability to show you the tput graph you are looking for per subscriber along with many other features. While the colors maybe a bit strong in the image below it serves the function you are looking for. I am hesitant to do a real time tput calculation on the radio if the CNS solution suffices


Hello.  First, thank you for taking the time to listen and to try to help.  I do appreciate it. :)

Second, yes, I've looked at CNS - it's great at some things, but I don't see anything in there that shows a list of all the customer's on an access point and a real-time updating screen of all their info, including throughput. In the AP there is MONITOR - WIRELESS which does show a list of SM's and it does show some good data, but it doesn't show a real time list of throughput for every station.

So, with the StarOS that we use now, we see this list when we look at an AP.  YES, this is an old-fashioned SSH/Text display - BUT it's also very very useful.  It's updated in real time (once per second) and every number on here changes.  It's showing us every station and their RX/TX throughputs in KBYTES/second.  We can instantly see what speed every client is getting.  

StarOS_AP_info.jpg

So, when client xx:xx:xx:xx:AF:D7 calls and says that his internet is ''slower than dialup'' and we can look and see tha t he is getting 259KBytes at that instant...  we know that his internet isn't really slow - it's actually just occupied and probably a computer downloading Updates, or by a Torrent or Cloud Storage program that he's unaware of, or someone next door stealing his WiFi  - and seeing that instant throughput reading is very, very, very useful info. Yes, graphing is also very important, and seeing longer term graphs is very useful as well - but it's totally different than seeing a real-time list of every client and their kbps or kBps throughput updated every second or two or five.

And - it's important to see all the clients at once.  Sometimes client who has become a -77 for some reason, when he's getting his 250 KBytes, that may be screwing up someone else.  I know - Cambium's Scheduler helps prevent that problem and that is one of many reasons that we're switching away from StarOS, but for many diagnostic situations, there's no substitute for seeing real-time throughput for all associated stations.

Another scenario - a client calls and they are trying to configure their email program.  Every time they click ''send and recieve'', they get no mail.  However, when they are doing that, we see a burst of data and instantly know that they ARE in fact picking up the mail... and that it's likely a filter in their Virus or SPAM or in their Email program that's filtering or blocking or something.  Being able to see a real time throughput helps point us where to look in an email situation.

So - yes, graphing with CACTI is great.  The CNS program is great.  But waiting 5 minutes to see one data point.... that's not real time throughput reports.

Right now, in the ePMP's Access Point list - it already has MONITOR - PERFORMANCE which already does have a Subscriber Module Statistics area.  And, that list already does show incrementing data totals for 'Total Uplink' and 'Total Downlink'.  If that list could subtract the previous value from the current value to get the difference (the delta) since the last display interval, and then divide that by the display interval - that would be all I'm asking for.

So, two new fields in that list that show the RX and TX values of:
Calculated by (Current Total Data - Previous Interval's Total Data)  / Webpage Auto Update Interval Time.


I think that's all we'd need.

Ideally, it'd also be nice to be able to change 'units' for the data, the same as we can for miles/kilometers.  It'd be good to be able to set the units, and then see all the data counters and settings represetned by bits, or bytes or whatever units the admin wants to see them in.  However - for now - we'd need to be able to see the throughput speed of all the assocated stations in a list - either (or both) the Wireless Performance list, and/or the Monitor Wireless list.

Thank you.

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Hi.  Here's a link to the feature request that some other people have submited.

http://community.cambiumnetworks.com/t5/Your-Ideas/Real-time-throughput-display/idi-p/39590

Everyone should go click the 'thumbs up' to KUDO this.  :)