Best cambium unlicensed backhaul

Need a backhaul solution for a 4 mile link. Ideally would like something that could produce 1G throughput which I know is a stretch. 500M would suffice. Anything out there unlicensed that could produce such a link? I’ve seen reports of 15km hops reaching 400M give or take at 40mhz in the force 400 series.

Any advise would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!

We are running a couple links with the 400c… we have a 4.5km link both 400c are connected to a HP 3ft radio waves antennas and its DS11 all day and night…its a 40mhz channel and its around 250-300mbps of throughput during our peak,

image

Link Test… done while 253mbps download was passing through…

image

As of right now only ePTP mode is available on the 400c, the AX chip is impressive and this link is in a noisy area and we are impressed with the spectral efficiency… others have also commented on the spectral efficiency. No gps sync either.

Using some ptp 550 on some links… the dual radio is a very handy feature… if you have available/clean channels then the 550 will perform well also. I will say that one should really consider what antenna you pair with either radio… but Im sure you have played with Link Planner so you can see what results you should expect from said link.

Here is a 550 link test using 2 40mhz channels, noisy environment… about 160mbps of traffic passing through when taken…

image

1 Like

Thanks for the info. We have 425’s ready to deploy and I think they will work… for now… but not for future.

What about the new Cnwave v3000’s at 60ghz? We are very rural, not much noise. I know ubiquiti has a long range 60ghz rated up to 12km with very impressive results at nearly 4km. Everything I have seen for the v3000 doesn’t surpass much more than 1.5 to 2km. Great product just not for this link it seems.

I’m almost thinking I need to run with ubiquiti for the type of link I need as much as I hate to…

There are a few options, the force400 will do around 800mbps with the right antennas, an 80mhz channel and clear line of sight.

The ptp550 and the 550e both can do upto 1.4gbps in an 80mhz channel, the e version is just the extended frequency range that allows use of 5.9 to 6.2ghz.

I dont think the wave3000 (60ghz) radios would be particularly good for that distance unless you are in a desert. the v5000 is an option but requires very little rain or you will get drops.

Cambium does need to make a ptp8xx series in 60ghz with high gain dishes.

Now Mikrotik does have some decent 60ghz ptp radios that will do 6km (4mile)

2 Likes

Hi Douglas when you say right antennas what would be the correct ones? I think I have used cheap antennas but never tried radiowaves since they are expensive but I dont know if an antenna can make a real difference

there is a clear difference between grades of antennas.

I dont know what you call cheap but we use the rd5g-30 as our cheapest and look at the md-5g37 as an expensive option (when you can find them).
We usually go for KPP KP-5PDN-2 for our ptp links but will go to radio waves if we need a bigger dish.

Things to note: some dishes really do need a shield (rd5g-30 is a good example) and some just need the radome to reduce wind loading on the mounts (KPP KP-5PDN-2), consider getting them.

RF cables of good quality should be used. In unlicensed bands with power restrictions you dont need heliax but dont accept rg6 or rg59 either. LMR195/200 are good for 90% of what is normally needed.

1 Like

Tks Douglas, have you ever seen a bid change using radiowave 30db disch vs rd5g-30? or a similar antenna gain comparison?

in signal strength, no. But SNR (CINR) yes!

A good dish antenna not only gives the dB gain you expect but also will provide good isolation from adjacent noise.

The UBNT RD5G-30 is a good performer but unless you put the iso-shield on it, its very noisy and will pickup signals behind it. For the cost of the dish and iso-shield, you can pickup a KP-5PDN-2.

I agree with @Douglas_Generous and generally will buy higher quality name brand antennas for backhaul/PtP use. Some things I like about or look for in a higher quality/more expensive antenna…

  • Typically have better front to back ratio and reduced side lobes for better collocation performance
  • Will have the ability to easily convert between H+V polarization to dual-slant polarity
  • Have handles or other safety attachment mechanisms so tower crew can easily install it
  • Have enclosures for specific radios to provide element protection
  • Have quick connect or waveguide type connection systems, like RF Elements
  • Have proper documentation including antenna patterns, this lends itself when trying to use in various RF planning tools
  • Have integrated or easy to get radome covers
4 Likes

Hello James, an awesome name by the way;

In regards to the cnWave product, this portfolio very much does PTP configurations but it’s not designed for long-range 60GHz backhaul. It’s based around connecting Fibre PoP’s to Facebook Terragrapgh’s DN; though it can absolutely be used short-distance backhaul in isolation. Because of this standard and Cambium Networks’ market goals for the cnWave 60GHz product, this and the lack of 5GHz redundancy are part and parcel.

Though I can almost guarantee Cambium may have a long-range 60GHz product in the future and will release a range of 6GHz products when spectrum becomes available.

Back to your question.

I’d look at a PTP 550 Connectorised, should be able to install a nice 6ft Dual-Pol antenna in a 2+0 configuration. When using LINKplanner it only uses an integrated PTP 550 on the Slave Unit; in theory, you could use the same RDH4511C antenna on both ends.

I’ve attached a LINKPlanner Report that I quickly threw together; should give you an indication of what to look out for when doing your own LINKPlanner setup.

Link_Mount Blackwood to DLS_Proposal_Report.pdf (130.7 KB)

2 Likes

We have cnWave and UBNT 60GHz links, and neither are good in rain

How bad and what range? Not too worried about degraded service as long as the link stays up. But if it goes down, that’s a problem.

If you have 80Mhz of clean 5Ghz spectrum available then the F400 radios are the way to go. Get the connectorized with some RF Elements Ultradishes or UltraHorns and you’re set. As much as I hate on ePMP AC the AX radios have so far been really reliable and impressive so far.

We have a couple of Miktrotik and Ubiquiti 60Ghz links but nothing over 1/4 mile and while I’ve been surprised at how well they hold up in downpours and ice storms I don’t believe there is any way they would stay up at 4 miles in even a light rain.

I think Ubiquiti 24Ghz might do it but really, if you have clean 5Ghz to burn then the F400’s are pretty hard to beat.

1 Like