Canopy_Support wrote: JTN39,
I'm not familiar with the OSPF advertisement response issue. Can you elaborate on the VLAN issues? Also, has this been reported to our technical support center? If so I would need your company nam :twisted: e, phone number, and your name (in a private message) so I can look up the call records. If there is a way to reproduce the issue we will work towards a solution.
Posting an issue to this forum will NOT get the same visibility as an escalated support case. Keep in mind this is a user community that was created to be used as a knowledge sharing media between users. It has grown rapidly and it is very difficult to read every post.
We would be more than happy to remediate the issues you have mentioned. We need more details.
hrmm there are two vinces
I have been privy to many conversations on R8 and can tell you that they are very aware of their delay and they are very frustrated that what they thought was going to be ready “earlier” turned out to be “buggier” than they were willing to release. However, nobody seems to be stating a missing element…they COULD have released software that wasn’t ready (many companies have done this)…but Moto decided to take the time-line hit (and the hits from frustrated people) and hold-off to delivery high-quality…(no I am not a Moto employee)…they would prefer "later and better"
R8 is a non-trivial release, since it’s using a completely new OS (for you programmers, you’ll understand how complex a new OS roll-out is “plus” the application UI to sit on top of it). Even Microsoft has problems rolling out a new OS and applications at the same time (and MS also suffers from frustrated users). However MS has groups of software engineers and programmers that are larger in number than the entire Canopy organization…yet they have the same kinds of problems.
I can fully sympathize with the frustration of “no communication” or “not enough communication”, which I’m sure 665 of you feel fully justified in feeling.
I don’t agree with the 666th person who ascribes evil or mal-intentioned actions behind this (VERY frustrating) delay.
We all have the right to state our frustration…however, I believe that professionalism suffers and (no benefit accrues) when it begins to degrade to something more acidic/acerbic and intentionally barbed…
…but I make no apologies for sharing my .02 worth, either…
(whew! If I send another of these I’ll have to pass the offering plate around after the sermon…MY APOLOGIES!!! <grin>)
BTW - it is totally and absolutely NOT a concern that unlicensed is being dropped by Canopy…just the opposite…the Canopy folks have already announced that they were watching one of the newest unlicensed areas (5.4 GHz) to add to their unlicensed portfolio. (has been in the press, so I’m not sharing insider information… 
)
You can kill that rumor ‘dead’ :lol:
Very well said.
Charles,
Your voice of calm is most welocme – espically on this “hot button” topic
CTCA-info wrote: they COULD have released software that wasn't ready (many companies have done this)...but Moto decided to take the time-line hit (and the hits from frustrated people) and hold-off to delivery high-quality...
You mean high-quality like the 7.07 release? Or high-quality like the 4.x releases? C'mon. Most of us here know the history of Motorola's "quality" software releases.
One wonders why they haven't done anything about the backhaul interference problem...
Even Microsoft has problems rolling out a new OS and applications
Worst possible analogy on several levels.
MS has groups of software engineers and programmers that are larger in number than the entire Canopy organization...yet they have the same kinds of problems.
Again, worst possible analogy. Windows has by some estimates hundreds of millions of lines of code and their software application suites are also titanic in scale. By contrast, it's highly unlikely that there is anything like 300,000 lines of code in the Canopy system.
I don't agree with the 666th person who ascribes evil or mal-intentioned actions behind this (VERY frustrating) delay.
We don't agree on several things, apparently. However, now you're putting words in my mouth - what was said was that MotoWi4 products seem to be getting all the attention at the expense of Canopy products. I ascribed evil, mal-intentioned actions to the telecommunications companies putting economic pressure on Motorola. Should you believe this is too 007 for you, then you have never dealt on a policital or business level with telcos.
We all have the right to state our frustration...however, I believe that professionalism suffers and (no benefit accrues) when it begins to degrade to something more acidic/acerbic and intentionally barbed...
How does "professionalism", as you describe it, help us or our customers? That argument neatly encapsulates all that is wrong with North America, IMNSHO. Sitting around patiently and waiting for something to happen has never accomplished very much... smacks loudly of cowardice and apathy.
Obviously, I'm not one to mince words.
THANK YOU, Shaman666, for letting me know that I misunderstood your concerns…and thank you for pointing my misundertanding with kindness instead of a flame - that is professionalism (IMHO)
We agree:
1) R8 is long overdue
2) Communications hasn’t been good
3) Many people are VERY, VERY frustrated
4) Motorola isn’t perfect
We disagree on some things (my analogies aren’t to your liking…sorry I tried!!! ), but at least we have an open forum…and we are both trying to be helpful to others that want to improve their networks and their customers’ experiences (while MAKING MONEY!!! :lol: )
My attempt to describe professionalism could have been better…maybe it’s like saying the signal (concerns about late R8 ) “could” be lost in some of the high-noise-floor (ways concerns are worded)…it doesn’t mean the signal is unimportant or even lost…but it means that the noise-level could prevent certain signals from being heard due to the noise…that’s all…
I am just as concerned, since I have to stand in front of 20-50 students and answer to many people monthly in our classes ‘why’ R8 is late (I don’t have all the answers and have shared what I have here). But having been in meetings where the marketing folks and the engineering folks are talking about how to crash on getting this out in the BEST way that they can and as ‘soon’ as it can, I can tell you it is not due to “sloth”…but I can understand how it feels that way.
You know, I bet with all the hard-working WISPS, users, consultants, etc. represented in this community that there are even some of OUR customers who think that we are not doing a good job…even when we’re breaking our back (or our bank-accounts :? ) to get it done…some customers will never be satisfied…we all hope we can improve so that we can satisfy (and get more) customers…
Thanks, again, for the clarification!!!
(OK…shorter sermon today…[and end of sermon series] so no passing of the offering plate…BUT would you please turn to hymn 104 and sing verses 1, 2, and 4… :lol: )
Wow, this has been a lot to read. At the risk of being flamed, here goes, because really, I don’t care…
I haven’t been on the forum for a bit, but it seems that most of the heated discussions in here involve Shaman and his rants towards Motorola. That’s fine, it is an open venue where we can share pretty much anything.
Just a note, as a beta tester for v8 I have seen that Motorola is not just sitting and letting v8 rot - they have been through a number of builds. As Charles said, v8 had more bugs in it than they had counted on and could not release it like that. If it makes anyone feel any better, I have not heard anything more than you as far as release dates go.
Oh, and have a nice day. 
Aaron
In a few short days it will be nine months since the build date on 7.3.6. The software introduced interference issues for those of us with heavily provisioned towers using 5.7Ghz radios and backhauls.
That’s not a rant. That’s the fact.
If you consider that sort of product quality and support to be acceptable, then best of luck to you.
I’ll have to agree with Shaman. Alhough I understand how hard progamming is (we have programmers in our staff and there is pulled hairs all around their chairs), Moto has been announcing this version to be release for this date, then for next month, and then who knows for when. This clearly show that inside Motorola, somebody DOES NOT understand how hard programming is and does not understand that the firmware might still be under a development stage where release promises can not yet be made. Programmers do now when to say that they’ll be finished in a week or a month, managers don’t.
I do agree that you are never going to make people 100% satisified but when you make an announcement and you don’t live up to it, and you do it more than once, you are bound to have unsatisfied customers. And then you do it more than once. What happens when you don’t pay a bill? are you given all this time? you keep making promises to pay, but you always come back saying “next month”, what happens? you know very well what happens. Yet, when you are the end consumers you are always olbigated to pay in time, not a day later, but the manufacturer is always allowed to be late and make false promises. We pay a premium for this products and struggle to meet our payrolls while their CEO’s are making millions. Just read an article on MSNBC on how they are making records salaries. They are makign 262 times more money than they average employee. In average, they make in a day, more than their employees make in a year. So I don’t think they need your protection Mr. CTCA. I’m sure there is very very smart people inside motorola (and those are the ones you are probably talking about), that can make this product do magic, but those are never invited to the decision making meetings, were mistakes like these happen. If you want to have a clear picture of how things very likely happen inside Moto’s offices, subscribe to the Dilbert comics.
If you want to have a clear picture of how things very likely happen inside Moto's offices, subscribe to the Dilbert comics.
lmao :lol: We have a number of those around our office. I thought I was the only one who worked with.... ummmm... those people. haha
Aaron