New to Canopy, please assist.

Hi all, I’m new to the Canopy system. I just moved and previously used cable internet, but where I am that is not an option. Luckily Canopy was available or otherwise I would have no connection at all. From what I hear Canopy is supposed to be faster than cable, but I’m seeing otherwise. I game alot, and my ping is average about 150, and every 15 min. or so service drops completely and “reconnects”. But by then I have been booted from the server I was in due to lag. If anyone can help me that would be great, I’m just gonna post all my device info and maybe someone can diagnose it. Thanks!

Device type Subscriber Modem - Multipoint Mode - 0a-00-3e-f0-03-df
Software Version CANOPY Nahum(SP3) Feb 15 2002 18:09:24
FPGA Version 121401a7
Device ESN 0a-00-3e-f0-03-df
Uptime 5d, 02:03:34
System Time 03:53:54 02/04/2005
Session Status REGISTERED
Data Slots Up 7
Data Slots Down 24
Air Delay 375 (approximately 3.48 miles (18375 feet))
RSSI 1093
Jitter 7
Ethernet Interface 100Base-TX Full Duplex

Current entry index: 0

Index: 0 Frequency: 5750 MHz ESN: 0a-00-3e-f0-02-63
Jitter: 5 RSSI: 997 Beacon Count: 40
Type: Multipoint Avail: 1 Age: 0 Lockout: 0 RegFail 0 Range: 18375 feet
Session Count: 2 No LUIDS: 0 Out of Range: 0 Rescan Req: 0
FrameNumber: 525 SectorID: 1 Color Code: 0 BeaconVersion: 1 SectorUserCount: 1
PercentDataDwn: 75 PercentDataUpHi: 0 NumDAckSlots: 3 NumContSlots: 3 NumUAckSlots: 3

Index: 1 Frequency: 5775 MHz ESN: 0a-00-3e-f0-02-60
Jitter: 9 RSSI: 799 Beacon Count: 21
Type: Multipoint Avail: 1 Age: 0 Lockout: 0 RegFail 0 Range: 0 feet
Session Count: 0 No LUIDS: 0 Out of Range: 0 Rescan Req: 0
FrameNumber: 310 SectorID: 1 Color Code: 0 BeaconVersion: 1 SectorUserCount: 0
PercentDataDwn: 75 PercentDataUpHi: 0 NumDAckSlots: 3 NumContSlots: 3 NumUAckSlots: 3
Index: 2 Frequency: 5800 MHz ESN: 0a-00-3e-f0-02-89
Jitter: 10 RSSI: 813 Beacon Count: 32
Type: Multipoint Avail: 1 Age: 0 Lockout: 0 RegFail 0 Range: 0 feet
Session Count: 0 No LUIDS: 0 Out of Range: 0 Rescan Req: 0
FrameNumber: 22 SectorID: 6 Color Code: 0 BeaconVersion: 1 SectorUserCount: 1
PercentDataDwn: 50 PercentDataUpHi: 0 NumDAckSlots: 3 NumContSlots: 3 NumUAckSlots: 3

jitter is a little on the high side is this the best you can get?

Are you using a reflector dish?
Do you have clear radio LOS and the dish has been optimally aligned?

At that distance I would have anticipated lower jitter and higher RSSI numbers.

I think the software version is too old, may be you upgranding the software the problem could be solved.

no way is canopy faster than cable modem! If you look at, you will see cable modems running 3-7 meg. Very unusual for canopy, at least in the stuff we have put in.

I’ve worked on a small Canopy network that had a mix of v3.0, v3.2, & v4.01 APs and SMs. It was stable. I added a few old “nahum(SP3)” SMs and started having problems with an existing v3.2 SM.

I upgraded to v3.2.5, then to v4.2.3, and then added the Calibration Data (to get the Spectrum Analyser mode to help track down the problem) and the problem disappeared without any further troubleshooting.

Your problem could, potentially, be related to software rather than jitter and signal strength. Upgrading the netire network to a newer – and uniform! – software version will at least eliminate one of the many variables working against you.

You could upgrade your unit yourself, but you should coordinate with the tech managing the entire Canopy network. In the upgrade above, I upgraded an AP’s FPGA to too high a version and lost connectivity with the nahum(SP3) units, and had to travel onsite for those stranded units. There may be other “gotchas” lurking out there.

Motorola have shifted away from the manual ftp/telnet ugrade process with the latest version, 6.1. They say they’ve done this because of the high number of RMAed units sent in because of botched upgrades.

I found Motorola’s instructions included with the upgrades to be confusing, incomplete, and sometimes wrong. No wonder their customers get into trouble.

Motorola’s tech support line, however, is outstanding!

Have fun!

thanks for all the replies. To answer your question I use a reflector dish, and I thought the system said that I was alligned to 100% efficiancy. The jitter is constantly at 7. Is there nothing I can do to lower it?

Also do I have to buy new equipment, or can I just download the updates? Thanks again.

You can download free updates from Motorola. Since you’re running version nahum(SP3), you’ll have to first upgrade to v3.2.5, and then upgrade a second time to v4.2.3.

You do need to coordinate with whomever is responsible for the AP you’re connecting to. Your unit will be the most reliable when both AP and SM are running the same version.

well I believe that the network admin is going to upgrade the software versions to everything, so maybe that will help. My speed seems to be fine, but I still keep dropping at random times.

Is this just going to be something I will have to deal with, or is there something else I can try. During a download I will get “Reset connection by server”, or when I’m playing a video game it just lags me out. Quite annoying. Any ideas?

Have patience. No, you shouldn’t have to live with the problem indefinely, but it will take time to work through the possible causes.

Look through the previous responses to your posting. The LOS (Line-of-Sight) is one you could make an evaluation on while waiting for the upgrades.

I see in your initial post that the AP is 3.5 miles away. Can you see the AP – or its tower or building – using a pair of binoculars? Radio-LOS, at 5 GHz, requires more ground and obstruction clearance than visual-LOS. The greater the distance, the greater the clearence required.

In the past I’ve installed a 5200SM about 36 feet off the ground to hit a 140-foot-high AP 1.2 miles away. When the wind was calm, it was fine; when the wind blew, it constantly re-registered (disconnected and reconnected). The jitter always spiked just before it failed. I raised the SM from 36 to 48 feet and the problem disappeared. Why? Most likely the 60-70-foot trees a few blocks away; the swaying branches apparently were the culprit.

Try to find a pattern to the times the link fails. Check your SM’s Status page and AP Eval Data page repeatedly if you think failure is likely. See if the Jitter and RSSI are fluctuating.

Here’s another thought:

Your intial post’s AP Eval Data shows 3 APs. The first 2 show “PercentDataDwn: 75”, but the third has “50”. The provider may not have all their APs configured the same. Motorola cautions that this setting must be identical with all units in an AP cluster. I don’t know what happens if they aren’t set the same. I also don’t know if this rule applies to neighboring APs that are not in the same cluster.

After your provider gets the Canopy software upgraded, the “AP Eval Data” will provide greater detail for troubleshooting.

Good luck!

Thanks for your help on this Teknix. We live on a farm in Kansas, and the AP is in perfect visible LOS (not trees or anything blocking the way). Now that you say something about the height, I feel I should let you know that my dish is only about 4 feet off the ground, while I am uncertain of the exact height of the AP. Could that be part of the problem?

And again thanks, I will wait and see if my isp upgrades the software (HOPEFULLY!). :slight_smile:

Yes! Do whatever you can immediately to get the dish as far off the ground as reasonable. An extra 10’ higher will make a big difference.

Kansas?!?! Where the heck in kansas are ya? Im in hays. I also have Fixed Wireless and I play Halo 2 all the time. NEVER do i get dropped from a game. If your system gets upgraded and configured right, you shouldn’t have any problems.



I’m in Overbrook. Awesome about the HALO, I was hoping it was just the config or setup. It sucked when I moved out here I didnt have highspeed, so I haven’t played HALO in months. I was level 22 in head to head in the first 2 weeks or so…i had withdraws! :slight_smile: Hopefully we’ll get it up and running good again.


in the AP eval data, that 50% could be a backhaul, not an AP, so that might not be the issue. Sounds like the height is the problem.

Teknix, quick question. Is there a height limit that you can’t exceed? Say I wanna put it on a tv tower to bypass trees (my friend was wondering that, I’m just gonna put mine at 10’ or so). Also, is it like standard cat5 in that the lead coming in needs to be boosted with a repeater every 50 feet? I’m asking that since the tv tower he wants to mount it on is about 20 feet off his house, and after we get the cable in we might be pushing 50. Thanks ahead of time!

I wouldn’t be worried about 50ft. If you want to use the best cable, use shielded Twisted Pair (Cat5 or 6). It will reduce any interference.

okay thanks i will use cat 5

You can run shielded CATV or outdoor CATV, depending on your RF environment to the tower. I have units that are 300’ up on towers, I have no problems whatsoever.

You really need to be careful with electromagnetic interference with the Canopy units. Shielded CATV is highly recommended.

No, there is not a height limitation for the Canopy unit itself. Yes, there is a cable length limit. The cable is providing an Ethernet link – either 10BaseT or 100BaseTX – with a cable length limit of 300 meters or 328 feet. Cat5 is sufficient for 100Mbps; Cat3 will work for 10Mbps.

The higher category grades are for faster speeds, and speed and interference are related, but not the interference from other RF transmitters. The higher grade wire is needed for faster Ethernet speeds because the “transmit” pair can interfere with the “receive” pair within the same cable. It doesn’t matter if you’re running the wire up a tower or inside a building.

Motorola recommends using shielded cable in noisy RF environments, such as a tower with multiple transmitters. The TV antenna mast on your home, however, is not a noisy place; the TV antenna is only receiving, not transmitting. A tower with a TV station’s transmitter would qualify as a noisy environment.

YOU CANNOT USE CATV CABLE! The shielded cable Motorola is talking about is still twisted-pair cable; 4 pairs, 8 conductors.

If you want to run a LONG cable, the “booster” you’ll need is simply an Ethernet Switch, available for $30-50 at Best Buy, Staples, even WalMart. These “switches” are different than “repeaters”, also known as “Ethernet hubs”; these don’t extend the distance.

But beware: the switch will extend the Ethernet link, but not the injected power from the Motorola Canopy Power Supply. The PS would have to be positioned at the end of the first cable from the Canopy unit.